QUOTE(benCKa @ Apr 5 2009, 12:12 PM) [snapback]543204[/snapback]
Mel B is hot. And so is that black girl from True Blood. A whole lot of American & Jamaican sprinters are hot too
QUOTE(Ray @ Apr 5 2009, 06:03 PM) [snapback]543202[/snapback]
I can see where you're coming from. But, what's the time duration needed for someone to deserve being shipped back in your eyes? Is there any amount of time you think a person should be able to live in Finland before becoming a true Finn, even if you do add the African-Finn title to their name?
I ask this because, say there's a Swedish white guy who comes to Finland and does the same crimes that the Somalian guy did. Should he be deported back to Sweden? Is it easy to tell what country he's from since he looks like everyone else? Or, is it a little more difficult? With the guy from Somalia, it was easy to look at him and say, "You're obviously not from around here, you can go back to where you came from." While with a white guy who does similar crimes, it's not likely that the same punishment would result.
So, the question is, are they being deported because of their crimes? Or are they being deported because they clearly look like someone who has a place to be deported to?
And, you used the word "civilized society" to describe Finland. Gotta be careful, because that implies that Somalia is uncivilized. You know, just looking out for ya.
To add to the conversation - Rosario Dawson is pretty attractive.
First of all the Swede would be an EU citizen so it wouldn't work the same way. But that's beside the point I know you're trying to make, so let's put it this way, if this refugee who comes to Finland shows no initiative of ever wanting to become a Finn and to contribute to the society in a positive way, then I don't think there even is a time limit, just send them away and never let em back
But yeah, you're a worldly man Ray, I can see that. The point you made is what's created much tumult in the press here as well.
And Somalia is pretty uncivilized Ray, I'm not afraid to say that. It's a country that just consists of rivaling tribes that kill each other because they don't belong to the right tribe. Somaliland is the only part of the country that has shown some sort of progress of becoming a united country at some point, and quite a few of the country's/area's leading politicians are people who've got an education in Europe and then got back to Somaliland to sort the country's things out, which is nice. But from what I've understood half of Somalia is a complete shit hole that lives in the Dark Ages
edit: Oh and the person who got deported was still a Somali citizen, despite having lived in Finland most of his live and had a permanent residence permit. Obviously he wouldn't have been deported if he was a Finnish citizen.
I love you, Ben. And Matt, this is what civilized discussion looks like, at least this is the highest intellectually we'll be able to achieve in this setting.
First, I didn't realize that there was a such thing as EU citizenship. I learned something new today! That sort of troubles me. It seems like that would really contribute to a rising sense of Euro-centrism. The more titles people use to define themselves, the more they separate themselves from "everyone else." A lot of people don't see the dangers in titling themselves as "white," "Catholic," "Irish," "Protestant," "Christian," "Muslim," "black," "American," etc. The more things you use to qualify who you are, the more you separate yourself from the rest of the world, and the narrower you make your outlook and expectations of others.
Anyway, to get back to Somalia, the reason I called to question the word "civilized," is that it's difficult to judge what is civilized and what isn't fairly. What is civilized? By what standard are we measuring civilization? Is civilization defined based on American middle class standards? By Finnish social expectations? Sure, warring tribal nations (again, qualifying yourself or defining yourself as a member of a tribe is dangerous like any other title) may seem uncivilized, but that's mostly because we don't have a good basis of perspective on what their reasons for battling with each other are. It's easy to look at a struggling African or middle eastern country and call them uncivilized based on the ideals of our predominantly Christian middle class values we have of our own society.
It's like comparing the US in the 1600's to the US of today. We don't consider ourselves uncivilized back then because the social climate dictated the need for certain actions. Europeans slaughtered millions of different "tribes" when they came to America, and we never once consider those actions uncivilized, because they were deemed necessary by the people carrying them out at the time. Put simply, we don't have a full understanding of the motivations and needs of the Somalian people, so it's easy to define them as uncivilized and primitive. It all aids a dangerous perception of black people being inferior.
Left Eye from TLC was so hot, she could roll a car over with her beauty.
